They've shipped my books. I was excited to find this blog which has loads of information on a delayed schedule vaccination program. She even recommended the book I bought as an excellent, middle-of-the-road resource for vaccines. I have also asked this nice lady how she has scheduled her baby's vaccinations and all that good stuff. I can't wait for my books to arrive! I'm so excited to be coming to some sort of conclusion about this whole thing.
Check out this information from Dr. Sears.
Showing posts with label vaccines. Show all posts
Showing posts with label vaccines. Show all posts
Tuesday, May 27, 2008
Friday, May 23, 2008
A Post in Which I Should Probably Have Just Written an Email
I bet you're wondering what we're doing about vaccines. Well, too bad that you're not, I'm going to tell you...so there.
Things are very different with the kids now than they were with the first three. We were faithful about taking the kids to every single appointment every three months and anxious about their weight and everything. So far, Lily has gotten her 2-week and two-month appointments on time. She was one month late for her four-month and we never took her for her six-month and of course still haven't taken her even though she's due for her 9-month. We're just not worried. We are pretty well versed on knowing when to be worried about the kids' health and taking them to the doctor is an exercise in futility. We take them, they look at them for, I kid you not, 60 seconds, tell us we're doing a great job and then send us home. Then the kids get sick from whatever germs they caught at the doctor's office. So since we're already so far behind with Lily, we are not going to take her to another appointment until we have thoroughly canvassed and prayed over the vaccine issue and feel like we have a decision that is good for our family. I have purchased three books to help with this. Actually, one of them I bought just in case I have to have a home birth this time around but I still want to tell you about it anyway.
The first is A Midwife's Story by Penny Armstrong. I am really interested in this story. She used to work in a hospital, from what I understand, and basically the book is about the unnatural environment for women in labor in a hospital and how she saw it negatively affect so many women. Then she worked among the Amish as a midwife and it opened her eyes to a more natural way to have a baby; viewing it as a process and not a sickness. Even though I am mostly unashamed to admit that I am quite fond of an epidural, I want to read it because I hate it that I have to fight tooth and nail everywhere I go to not have another C-section. Since the OB group I'm with discusses every month whether they should stop doing VBACs, I feel I need to prepare myself for an unassisted home birth; midwives are not allowed to attend VBAC home births here and I flatly refuse to have another C-section, just because I had one before and "they" are scared of being sued. I can't remember where I heard about this book...I'm sure it was probably from One Thing or some other blog I read.
The second one is How to Raise a Healthy Child in Spite of Your Doctor by Robert S. Mendelsohn, MD. I got this one from One Thing, also. Speaking of her, did you see how she read The Way Home, too? That book has been a life changer for so many women I respect; it's amazing! Anyway...I was interested in it because of all the things I stated in the paragraph above, above. I hope that at this point we've figured a lot of things out and I am interested to see how often we take the kids to the doctor, pay our co-pay and it was totally needless. It's not that I don't think doctor's are useful and have their place, but...well, they have their place and I think in the past I've given too much credence to what they've said, when they actually had no idea what they were talking about.
The third is The Vaccine Book by Robert Sears. I looked at a lot of books and read tons of reviews and I felt that this book seemed the least biased in either direction. It's supposed to tell you what the vaccines are, how they're made and the pros and cons of getting them so you can make an informed decisions about them and gives a good timeline for delayed vaccines if that suits you. And did you see Kristen's comment about when she gets vaccines for her kids? How do you find a doctor that is inline with your view on vaccines? It's a lot to think about.
I would have just checked them out of the library but the library didn't have a single one of them...of course. But, I got free shipping from Amazon! Woohoo.
I am coming along to the "ooooo...I'm most definitely pregnant" phase of being knocked up. I have some nausea but oh, the fatigue!!! I am sooooo tired. I just want to sleep all afternoon. Right now my stupendous husband is off with the three older kids at the swimming pool. Lily is sleeping. When I'm done writing this I'm going to get some water and snooze my way through some golf. Maybe I should think about dinner instead. I bought some of these vitamins from Pilgrim's Pride. Miriam Heppner recommended them and hopefully they will help me with this horrible tiredness I get. We played hooky from school for two days so that I could randomly nod off. Admittedly today I spent much of the morning searching for houses in San Antonio because I am so positive this house thing isn't going to work here. It's been 7 weeks and counting. We lose our lock on the interest rate next week, next Saturday or Sunday I think.
Oh and I'm reading The Narrative of Sojourner Truth from Dailylit.com. I was reading two Jane Austen biographies but they're the kinds of books I need in my hand to read because I lose so much continuity, since it's an email per chapter.
I hope I didn't confuse you or bore you to death. Are you awake?? WAKE UP! It's rude to sleep when someone is talking to you. OK, you can go back to what you were doing now.
Things are very different with the kids now than they were with the first three. We were faithful about taking the kids to every single appointment every three months and anxious about their weight and everything. So far, Lily has gotten her 2-week and two-month appointments on time. She was one month late for her four-month and we never took her for her six-month and of course still haven't taken her even though she's due for her 9-month. We're just not worried. We are pretty well versed on knowing when to be worried about the kids' health and taking them to the doctor is an exercise in futility. We take them, they look at them for, I kid you not, 60 seconds, tell us we're doing a great job and then send us home. Then the kids get sick from whatever germs they caught at the doctor's office. So since we're already so far behind with Lily, we are not going to take her to another appointment until we have thoroughly canvassed and prayed over the vaccine issue and feel like we have a decision that is good for our family. I have purchased three books to help with this. Actually, one of them I bought just in case I have to have a home birth this time around but I still want to tell you about it anyway.
The first is A Midwife's Story by Penny Armstrong. I am really interested in this story. She used to work in a hospital, from what I understand, and basically the book is about the unnatural environment for women in labor in a hospital and how she saw it negatively affect so many women. Then she worked among the Amish as a midwife and it opened her eyes to a more natural way to have a baby; viewing it as a process and not a sickness. Even though I am mostly unashamed to admit that I am quite fond of an epidural, I want to read it because I hate it that I have to fight tooth and nail everywhere I go to not have another C-section. Since the OB group I'm with discusses every month whether they should stop doing VBACs, I feel I need to prepare myself for an unassisted home birth; midwives are not allowed to attend VBAC home births here and I flatly refuse to have another C-section, just because I had one before and "they" are scared of being sued. I can't remember where I heard about this book...I'm sure it was probably from One Thing or some other blog I read.
The second one is How to Raise a Healthy Child in Spite of Your Doctor by Robert S. Mendelsohn, MD. I got this one from One Thing, also. Speaking of her, did you see how she read The Way Home, too? That book has been a life changer for so many women I respect; it's amazing! Anyway...I was interested in it because of all the things I stated in the paragraph above, above. I hope that at this point we've figured a lot of things out and I am interested to see how often we take the kids to the doctor, pay our co-pay and it was totally needless. It's not that I don't think doctor's are useful and have their place, but...well, they have their place and I think in the past I've given too much credence to what they've said, when they actually had no idea what they were talking about.
The third is The Vaccine Book by Robert Sears. I looked at a lot of books and read tons of reviews and I felt that this book seemed the least biased in either direction. It's supposed to tell you what the vaccines are, how they're made and the pros and cons of getting them so you can make an informed decisions about them and gives a good timeline for delayed vaccines if that suits you. And did you see Kristen's comment about when she gets vaccines for her kids? How do you find a doctor that is inline with your view on vaccines? It's a lot to think about.
I would have just checked them out of the library but the library didn't have a single one of them...of course. But, I got free shipping from Amazon! Woohoo.
I am coming along to the "ooooo...I'm most definitely pregnant" phase of being knocked up. I have some nausea but oh, the fatigue!!! I am sooooo tired. I just want to sleep all afternoon. Right now my stupendous husband is off with the three older kids at the swimming pool. Lily is sleeping. When I'm done writing this I'm going to get some water and snooze my way through some golf. Maybe I should think about dinner instead. I bought some of these vitamins from Pilgrim's Pride. Miriam Heppner recommended them and hopefully they will help me with this horrible tiredness I get. We played hooky from school for two days so that I could randomly nod off. Admittedly today I spent much of the morning searching for houses in San Antonio because I am so positive this house thing isn't going to work here. It's been 7 weeks and counting. We lose our lock on the interest rate next week, next Saturday or Sunday I think.
Oh and I'm reading The Narrative of Sojourner Truth from Dailylit.com. I was reading two Jane Austen biographies but they're the kinds of books I need in my hand to read because I lose so much continuity, since it's an email per chapter.
I hope I didn't confuse you or bore you to death. Are you awake?? WAKE UP! It's rude to sleep when someone is talking to you. OK, you can go back to what you were doing now.
Wednesday, May 14, 2008
Vaccines, Part Deux
After taking a breath and trying to become reasonable about this, I did some research and have learned a few things. Here is what I am learning.
- In the 1970's they used an aborted baby from a family, who supposedly aborted the baby because they had too many children, to develop a cell line culture for the chicken pox virus vaccine line, and in the '60's, aborted babies from women who had been exposed to rubella. From my reading the cell line of the aborted babies are what have been used since they were aborted 40 or so years ago. They say that using human cell lines are safer than using animal cell lines (such as monkey livers and the like). A lot of this information I found here. I have tried to verify some of the information by looking at the NVPO website. I searched for the terms "abort" and "aborted" but didn't find anything related to using aborted fetal tissue for vaccines.
- This is an interesting list of drugs and vaccines that are developed on aborted fetal tissue and some alternatives to use that are not. There is no alternative for the chicken pox vaccine. Their entire website is dedicated to "pro-life outreach" and their major research project right now is this whole aborted fetal tissue issue. I plan to spend more time looking at their website and what they have learned at time allows.
- I found this quote yesterday on Vaccine Truth: "...a number of vaccines are grown on human cells from aborted fetuses. The new chicken pox vaccine made by Merck Frosst Pharmaceuticals is grown on the MRC-5 cell line derived from the normal lung tissue of a 14-week-old male fetus aborted "for psychiatric reasons." So are the polio and hepatitis A vaccines. The rubella virus in the MMR (measles, mumps, rubella) three-in-one shot is grown on the WI-38 cell line-developed in 1961 from an aborted three-month-old female fetus." This tells me that it seems whole lots of aborted babies are not being bought, but one was used - each for the MMR and Varivax - and is still being used to make vast amounts of vaccines. Since I don't know how vaccines are developed and what their characteristics are this is only an assumption. Vaccine Truth is a website that is highly on the "DO NOT VACCINATE" side of the argument so any information found there I feel, must be taken with a grain of salt, but I think it's irresponsible to totally discount the veracity of what they are saying because one believes they are wacky.
- From the CDC website: "Does MMR vaccine contain fetal or embryonic tissue? If so, what kind?"
"The rubella vaccine virus is cultured in human cell-line cultures, and some of these cell lines originated from aborted fetal tissue, obtained from legal abortions in the 1960's. No new fetal tissue is needed to produce cell lines to make these vaccines, now or in the future. Fetal tissue is not used to produce vaccines; cell lines generated from a single fetal tissue source are used; vaccine manufacturers obtain human cell lines from FDA-certified cell banks. After processing, very little, if any, of that tissue remains in the vaccine."
The CDC site also has this.
- And then I found this at Free Republic, but I think they quoted it from CoG.
For over thirty years pharmaceutical companies in this country have been producing vaccines derived from tissues of aborted fetuses, a fact that was brought to light when several prominent Catholic newspapers published articles on the morality of using the vaccines. The trouble began when a new law in St. Louis County, Mo. required food handlers to obtain the Hepatitis-A vaccine for employment. When the source of the vaccine was revealed, many principled individuals objected and with good reason. As this information has become public, more and more physicians and parents are troubled by the ethical issues involved.
During the Rubella epidemic of 1964, some doctors advised exposed pregnant women to abort their children. The resulting virus strain developed was known in the science world as RA/27/3, where R=Rubella, A=Abortus, 27=27th fetus tested, 3=third tissue explant. There were actually 26 abortions prior to finding the right “species” with the active virus. The vaccine was then cultivated on the lung tissue of yet another aborted infant, WI-38. WI-38 (Wistar Institute 38) was taken from the lung tissue of an aborted female infant at 3 months gestation in the 1960s. A second human cell line, MRC-5 was derived from a male at 14 weeks gestation in the 1970s. They were used to cultivate the weakened virus strains of several diseases to produce immunizations. These two human cell lines cultivated in the lab continue to provide an ongoing source for many widely used vaccines.
- I thought this was good information. He is the NatruoDoc.
In the end, there is a lot of information to be had out there about this. I'd like to study how the vaccines are developed and what the role is, in it's entirety, of aborted fetal tissue in the making of vaccines. I am still trouble by this, but have not come to any sort of decision about whether to vaccinate or not. I'll share this information with Del and see what my Aunt Janet (who is a doctor) says and what my Aunt Diana says and we'll go from there. Sorry to trouble you with my horror.
- In the 1970's they used an aborted baby from a family, who supposedly aborted the baby because they had too many children, to develop a cell line culture for the chicken pox virus vaccine line, and in the '60's, aborted babies from women who had been exposed to rubella. From my reading the cell line of the aborted babies are what have been used since they were aborted 40 or so years ago. They say that using human cell lines are safer than using animal cell lines (such as monkey livers and the like). A lot of this information I found here. I have tried to verify some of the information by looking at the NVPO website. I searched for the terms "abort" and "aborted" but didn't find anything related to using aborted fetal tissue for vaccines.
- This is an interesting list of drugs and vaccines that are developed on aborted fetal tissue and some alternatives to use that are not. There is no alternative for the chicken pox vaccine. Their entire website is dedicated to "pro-life outreach" and their major research project right now is this whole aborted fetal tissue issue. I plan to spend more time looking at their website and what they have learned at time allows.
- I found this quote yesterday on Vaccine Truth: "...a number of vaccines are grown on human cells from aborted fetuses. The new chicken pox vaccine made by Merck Frosst Pharmaceuticals is grown on the MRC-5 cell line derived from the normal lung tissue of a 14-week-old male fetus aborted "for psychiatric reasons." So are the polio and hepatitis A vaccines. The rubella virus in the MMR (measles, mumps, rubella) three-in-one shot is grown on the WI-38 cell line-developed in 1961 from an aborted three-month-old female fetus." This tells me that it seems whole lots of aborted babies are not being bought, but one was used - each for the MMR and Varivax - and is still being used to make vast amounts of vaccines. Since I don't know how vaccines are developed and what their characteristics are this is only an assumption. Vaccine Truth is a website that is highly on the "DO NOT VACCINATE" side of the argument so any information found there I feel, must be taken with a grain of salt, but I think it's irresponsible to totally discount the veracity of what they are saying because one believes they are wacky.
- From the CDC website: "Does MMR vaccine contain fetal or embryonic tissue? If so, what kind?"
"The rubella vaccine virus is cultured in human cell-line cultures, and some of these cell lines originated from aborted fetal tissue, obtained from legal abortions in the 1960's. No new fetal tissue is needed to produce cell lines to make these vaccines, now or in the future. Fetal tissue is not used to produce vaccines; cell lines generated from a single fetal tissue source are used; vaccine manufacturers obtain human cell lines from FDA-certified cell banks. After processing, very little, if any, of that tissue remains in the vaccine."
The CDC site also has this.
- And then I found this at Free Republic, but I think they quoted it from CoG.
For over thirty years pharmaceutical companies in this country have been producing vaccines derived from tissues of aborted fetuses, a fact that was brought to light when several prominent Catholic newspapers published articles on the morality of using the vaccines. The trouble began when a new law in St. Louis County, Mo. required food handlers to obtain the Hepatitis-A vaccine for employment. When the source of the vaccine was revealed, many principled individuals objected and with good reason. As this information has become public, more and more physicians and parents are troubled by the ethical issues involved.
During the Rubella epidemic of 1964, some doctors advised exposed pregnant women to abort their children. The resulting virus strain developed was known in the science world as RA/27/3, where R=Rubella, A=Abortus, 27=27th fetus tested, 3=third tissue explant. There were actually 26 abortions prior to finding the right “species” with the active virus. The vaccine was then cultivated on the lung tissue of yet another aborted infant, WI-38. WI-38 (Wistar Institute 38) was taken from the lung tissue of an aborted female infant at 3 months gestation in the 1960s. A second human cell line, MRC-5 was derived from a male at 14 weeks gestation in the 1970s. They were used to cultivate the weakened virus strains of several diseases to produce immunizations. These two human cell lines cultivated in the lab continue to provide an ongoing source for many widely used vaccines.
- I thought this was good information. He is the NatruoDoc.
In the end, there is a lot of information to be had out there about this. I'd like to study how the vaccines are developed and what the role is, in it's entirety, of aborted fetal tissue in the making of vaccines. I am still trouble by this, but have not come to any sort of decision about whether to vaccinate or not. I'll share this information with Del and see what my Aunt Janet (who is a doctor) says and what my Aunt Diana says and we'll go from there. Sorry to trouble you with my horror.
Tuesday, May 13, 2008
Vaccines
I've been thinking a lot about vaccines lately because of all the controversy surrounding them. I haven't even begun to talk to Del about it because I just don't know which way to go: vaccinate or don't vaccinate. Anyway, I just happened across this blog which had a link to this. I noticed that under MMR, M-R-Vax, Imovax, Havrix, Biavax and Varivax, several of which my kids have received, they have listed as an animal byproduct ingredient "human diploid cells from aborted fetal tissue." I just don't know what to say about that. You mean they're buying aborted babies to make vaccinations for my children??? What do you know about this?
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